How do you know if running for office is right for you? Join Joe and Martín in this episode to learn how potential candidates determine if they’re fit to run for office. Joe interviews Anthony Robinson of the National Democratic Training Committee to discuss candidate trainings and whether one is right for you.
In this episode, Joe and Martín discuss how to determine if it is financially feasible for you to run, how to harness your core values to craft a compelling campaign narrative, and how to make that difficult decision of whether to run for President of the United States or start a little closer to home. Anthony Robinson of the National Democratic Training Committee joins Joe this week to discuss the benefits of attending a candidate training, and the work we can all do to diversify the political arena.
Resources
Why I Run: 35 Progressive Candidates Who Are Changing Politics by Kate Childs Graham
National Democratic Training Committee
Connect with us!
If you have campaign questions or want to learn more, reach out to us using the contact information below.
Twitter: @cmpwrkshp
Instagram: @TheCampaignWorkshop
Email: marketing@thecampaignworkshop.com
Joe Fuld
Twitter: @joefuld
Instagram: @joefuld
Martín Diego Garcia
Twitter: @gmartindiego
Instagram: @gmartindiego
Presented by The Campaign Workshop
(Intro Music)
Joe Fuld (00:05):
Hey friends, you're listening to how to win a campaign where you'll get an insider's perspective that teaches you not only how to run, but how to win. I'm Joe Fuld
Martín Diego Garcia (00:15):
And I'm Martín Diego Garcia. And you can follow us at CMPWRKSHP on Twitter or @thecampaignworkshop on Instagram. Welcome and thanks so much for tuning in to listen to episode one of How to Win a Campaign. Joe, it's finally happening. How excited are you?
Joe Fuld (00:32):
Martín, I'm so excited because this podcast is the culmination of a lot of the work that we do already, right? We train people how to run for office. We've been writing on our blog at thecampaignworkshop.com for the past five years, twice a week, and we really believe in the idea of giving people information to empower them to be better advocates and having a podcast is just a bigger megaphone for us to get a chance to reach more people.
Martín Diego Garcia (01:03):
Yeah, and we get to talk to each other, which is not often the case, but this is going to be the first of a 10 part series. So if you want to learn more about the podcast, check out our trailer episode that dives into why we're doing this. But on this episode we're actually going to be digging into probably one of the most important decisions a candidate can make when starting a campaign, which is actually deciding they want to run for office. Right? And this is really worth sort of some of the real meaty look in the mirror work really begins. So Joe, when you're thinking of running for office or, or advising somebody on deciding to run for office, what are some things you talk to them about?
Joe Fuld (01:40):
Well, we talk about the whole idea of really understanding why you're running, that you're running to help your community. That there are specific issues you care about, that you're engaged and involved. Those are the positive reasons to run for office and really being able to answer the question, here's why I'm running and here's what I want to do. In this episode, when we talked to Anthony Robinson, we also talk about the reasons not to run, like revenge, not a good reason to run for office. So really thinking about that, making sure that you go through a process to run. Often what drives people to run is emotion. And I know Martín, as you've trained people around the country, one of the things that is really important is sure you want to have a passion to run for office, but you also want to be politically smart about it. So I mean, what do you see as some of those sort of challenges of having the fire in the belly but also making sure you're tactically thinking about can you win this race?
Martín Diego Garcia (02:41):
Yeah, totally. So I think when we do our trainings, we often have folks who do a personal assessment, political assessment and a financial assessment that really hones into what you're talking about, that you have sort of got that fire in your belly, that you see some injustice or you see something that you need to change in your neighborhood, your community, your state, and you decide that elective office is how to do it . First you want to really take us hard, look in the mirror and do a personal assessment, right, of, am I ready to do this? Am I healthy enough to live through a campaign? Is my family and friends supporting me? Right, have you sort of pulled those folks together? Because yes, you as the candidate, it will be your name on the ballot, but you are really bringing your sort of network, family friends into this with you. So you want to make sure that you have their support too. And then really look at the politics here, right? Like is this the right time for you? Is this the right race for you? Does this office actually do the things that you are passionate about changing, right? Did they have the power to change those things? And then lastly, look at the money, right? Like do you have the money? Can you raise the money? Can you take time off work? Looking at those three big pieces of your life are going to be really helpful and in figuring out if, if deciding to run and going forward is the right the right path for you.
Joe Fuld (03:56):
Yeah, I mean Martín you said right? That personal buy-in of making sure your friends, family really want you to do this. I mean, there's this sort of parks and rec version of running for office where you're running for city council and all of a sudden you have a gigantic campaign bus that you're driving all over the district and that crowds of people come and shower you and you have TV crews following you. That is not the way it works. Buckets of money will not rain from the sky. It really is about buy-in from friends, family, people in the community and your drive to understand that you're going to be spending four to six hours a day raising money, sitting in a room, asking your friends and family for money. And that is really hard and you want to make sure, listen, not every political campaign, the majority political campaigns take a lot of risks. There's no guarantee that you're gonna win, but there are definitely some political campaigns that you run in that you might have a higher than likely average to lose, right? You want to reduce the odds of losing and increase, the odds of winning. So that's picking the right district, making sure your friends and family are supportive, making sure that you've really gone down and do you have real relationships in the district. And then done the math about, as you said, Martín, how much money do you really need? We like people to do with the personal assessment, sort of a worksheet where they really go put together everyone that they think could knock on a door or raise money or give them money. Put that in one place and calculate the amount of money that you could get from friends, family, and other people that you know. And if that amount is less than a third on paper, than the total that you think you're going to need to raise. So let's say you're trying to raise $300,000 and you can't figure out how to get $100,000 on paper, then you really want to rethink the idea of should you be running. So much of this is about sort of a clock of how quickly you can raise the money, how quickly you can engage your community. And those folks that have built up trust and built up a personal brand are ones that are better suited to running for office than people who have not been involved in the past. And I don't mean politically involved, I just mean involved in the community in general.
Martín Diego Garcia (06:19):
Absolutely. I often encourage folks as they're looking at their own personal resume to really look at how am I connected to this community? Have you been involved? Have you been on your local PTA or your local boys and girls club? Have you done anything with the community that you can point back to to say, I have connections to this community. I understand the challenges, the concerns, the issues that we are facing and I've already been doing things about them, right? I'm not just stepping into politics because one day I woke up and was like, Oh, I'm kind of bored and have some time on my hands, so I'm going to run for office and think that that was a good use of your time. You really want to sort of think through how have I been involved? How can I bring those networks of folks in there? How can I really show that I'm doing this for the benefit of the district, the community, the state, and not as a personal sort of pat on my back or gain or ego boost for myself
Joe Fuld (07:11):
And there's some like some barriers you have to overcome. Like do you like solving problems? Do you like digging in to figure that out? Can you handle talking to people, to random strangers? Can you handle talking to your friends and family on the phone? I mean every year with on the fundraising piece, I have some candidate who works for us and I love them dearly, but who works with us, who calls me and says, Hey Joe, can you give me a list of strangers cause I'm sick and tired of calling my family, right? And what I'll say is, no, these are the folks who are going to give you money. Strangers are really only going to start to give you money once they see that you're building power and that you have some connection with a friend of theirs. Right? And that takes time. Listen, we're big believers in online fundraising, but you know if you're running in a smaller race, the majority of your online fundraising is going to come from your friends and family and their friends and their friends. It's not going to come from people who all of a sudden who have said, wow, you're running for city council. I want to randomly write you a check. It usually doesn't happen that way.
Martín Diego Garcia (08:19):
Yeah. I think you're right. Right. As you started off, you were talking about what are the good and bad motivations for running. I think for every candidate who is listening to this and thinking, I'm considering running for office. If you can't answer the why, I'm running for office in a succinct way that connects your personal experience, your lived truth to the community that you're running with. I think you really, really need to take some time and start there. I think if you want to add to your book, your book list, the Kate Childs Graham's book, Why I Run, a good resource for inspiration as a good place to start.
Joe Fuld (08:49):
Yeah. It has a forward by Tammy Duckworth, by the way. It's a great book and we did an interview with Kate on our blog and it's up there. We'll put it in the show notes, but it's, it's a nice read and it's a good way to look at motivation.
Martín Diego Garcia (09:05):
Yeah. In other resources, if you go to our back to our blog at thecampaignworkshop.com we actually have an ebook on deciding to run that has some pretty useful tools in there to give you a sense of how many votes do you need to get, what do you need to think about in terms of how much money you will have to raise and where to find that information. So by all means, go take a look at that too. But Joe, I know that you got the chance to interview Anthony Robinson from the National Democratic Training Committee, which we're about to go into that interview, but any highlights teaser for the folks?
Joe Fuld (09:32):
Anthony's great. He has a wide range of experience and everything from being a Marine to working on campaigns to working at the Truman National Security Project. He's just really got a wide variety of ways that he talks about training and the National Democratic Training Committee does great work. So let's take a listen and then we can chat again on the other side.
(Music)
Joe Fuld (10:02):
Today we have a really great guest. We have Anthony Robinson with the National Democratic Training Committee. Anthony has over 17 years of experience working with federal, state, local partners to develop the skills and build diverse training operatives. Right prior to working at NDTC Anthony was the director of training and public engagement at the Truman National Security Project. He is a former Marine, he was an Obama appointee and he has a lot of great experience to share with us on training. So Anthony, welcome to the show.
Anthony Robinson (10:34):
Thank you very much. My mother would appreciate that introduction.
Joe Fuld (10:37):
Now where are we talking to you today? Where are ya?
Anthony Robinson (10:40):
I'm actually at headquarters in Chicago right now, but I'm based in DC though cause that's where all the political action is happening for for the most part.
Joe Fuld (10:48):
Yeah. Well I used to live in Chicago. It is a great place. Anyway, we're really excited to talk to you today about deciding to run for office. And so first of all, I mean, the first question I think we always ask everyone when we're talking about deciding to run is, Anthony, have you ever thought of running for office?
Anthony Robinson (11:06):
Interestingly enough, I'm asked a lot, have I decided the answer is no, not as of yet because I want to train people to run for office, but a politics runs deep in my family. Both of my parents were involved in the civil rights movement. I grew up with them running for everything from board of education to chair of the PTA. And so I was in student government with the things like legislative school. So it's in my blood and I just have different ways that it manifests. But who knows.
Joe Fuld (11:35):
So you're the political director at the National Democratic Training Committee. Before then you were at the Truman National Security Project. And so you've done a lot of different politics and worked with a lot of different people, including like briefing military people, working with candidates. So you have a pretty good understanding of a real variety of different candidates that have run for office. Tell us what kind of research should somebody do before they actually run for office?
Anthony Robinson (12:03):
Absolutely. That's a great question, Joe, and much like the work that I, that you do in, in training people, you know, you really have to have that serious conversation with yourself, your loved ones, a partner, and really do your research. But I always say talk to your family and your support system first because it's not just you in it by yourself. It's going to be a team effort. It's going to be a family effort. It's going to be a village effort. And you know, it's time to, it's important to talk about the time commitments. You know, it, it takes some time to, whether it's just filling out the paperwork, to putting together a campaign staff that takes time. And so they need to know, you need to know and be realistic, be truthful with yourself about, do you have that,uthat type of time. Do you have the finances? Do you have the support of your job? Are you going to leave your job? Those are some of the things that we talk up front about initially cause you should consider.
Joe Fuld (12:54):
Yeah, I mean, so talking more about that time commitment, right? At different levels. The timing's different things, but still, if you're, if you have a family, a spouse, you have a job or a couple of different jobs and can't take off from your job, running for office can be pretty challenging. I mean, do you find that that almost limits the pool of candidates that you see?
Anthony Robinson (13:21):
Well, you know, I look at it this way, Joe, you know, it's, it's almost like the first time, I don't know if you've done the polar plunge before. You know, from the outside it seems ridiculous that this is something that you would do, but it might be a friend or a partner that coerces you or convinces you to do it. And you know, running for office is almost like that. There are a lot of motivations for running for office. It could be. I am disheartened by the public education system in my, in my city. And so that urges me to, or that might urge me to run for the board of education. It could be, you know, I'm really appreciative of the education that my children received and I want to work to ensure that it stays that way. Now if it's on the grander piece where I'm tired of what's happening with the pensions for the state workers or whatever, then that might lead you to run for a state office. So there are a lot of different motivations, but a lot of people get motivations from the people that they are around. Sometimes, yes, it is the, the normal politics that you see on, on TV and you're just tired of, of that and you want to get involved. That has motivated me on certain days. But other times it's what's happening in your neighborhood or it could be, I, you know, I saw Joe do it. I respect Joe and you know, maybe it's something I can do. You know, I'm really appreciative of the education that my children received and I want to work to ensure that it stays that way. So there are a lot of different motivations. It doesn't always have to be like a negative turn, you know, in the, in this climate, people think, well in the age of Trump or in the age of these other democratic norms being torn down at that, that negative impact. And that has motivated a lot of people. But understanding--
Joe Fuld (15:02):
But revenge, right, is not a good motivation to run for office?
Anthony Robinson (15:05):
No, no, no, no, no. I have heard this somebody much wiser than me said that anger is a great subject but a horrible master. So if it's something, if anger can kind of direct you and move you in a positive direction, okay, but if it's, if it's your sole, you know, guide, then it's not going to turn out the way that you that you should expect. But getting back to be, to the why and asking that that question as far as motivation and how that factors in, we have a training that talks about creating your story and be able to get it down to either a short 30 second elevator pitch or either something that you can take out onto the stump for a longer speech. And it's really why I'm here, why this should matter to you and how we're in this together. You have to make it relatable. You have to make it relatable. And this is across ethnicity, culture, gender, orientation. There's something in your message that I have to be able to relate to that I can trust this person or we have shared values. And so I think that's critically important that you really have to get that down pat. I mean, in order to, to move the needle with the audience.
Joe Fuld (16:12):
Yeah. And so how do you suggest people decide on what level they should run for? Right. Not everyone gets up and says, and it's not really possible, right? To get up and say, I'm going to run for U.S. Senate without having a base of support. But how do you decide whether it's you're running for city council, running for school board, running for U.S. Senate. You talked a little bit about motivation, but talk about some of the other factors that come into a decision like that.
Anthony Robinson (16:39):
Great question. I saw a lot of this working in the Obama administration and a lot of my fellow appointees wanted to run for office. And a lot of them, lot of it many of them and many were successful. Some not so much, you know, going straight for the Senate or the U.S. Congress. But you know, we need people at the state and local levels we need mayors, we need city councilmen and women. We need dog catchers. We need city coroners. We need we need all of those things. So I think that you should look at the qualifications. I think you should seriously look at what you're up against. You know what type of race that it might be, filing deadlines, all of those things should go into deciding what level you you run at by I, I tend to believe we're at in DTC we're very focused on state and local Democrats running because it's about building that bench. And if you're going to have a longterm vision, then I think it's important that you start to build up the trust and the respect. Cause I mean when we look at our democracy and people having trust in our institutions, if that's free and fair elections, people need to have trust in the system and the people that they're electing. And so that can start out as mayor or as a and then move up to state legislature and then potentially flip the Senate and the house.
Joe Fuld (17:54):
Absolutely. So talk a little bit about the obstacles that our people are facing in running for office right now. Women, people of color. Just like give us a sense of what those obstacles are that you see candidates facing and what they do to overcome them.
Anthony Robinson (18:10):
Well that's a great question. And this goes back to the work that, that we are doing and that I have worked, the space that I've worked in making more diverse, inclusive and equitable platforms. So I mean this goes back to even my national security days. I've done writings for campaign expo. Have worked with several unions talking about this. It's imperative that we change the dynamics of not just candidates that are running because representation matters, but also in the campaign staff. So internally as well. I mean that plays a part in how you poll. That plays a part in how you communicate, how you message. And if we just have kind of a linear way of, of viewing a demographic, you're not, you're not setting yourself up for success. So let me answer the question about what do we need to do? What obstacles. Number one is kind of simple. This is going to sound probably overly simple. It's, you know, should I be here? Do I belong here? That's the question that comes up a lot for many people. They're kind of groomed to run. I've seen that if I can be quite honest in kind of the older white male environments, you know, people were kind of groomed from when they graduate college just to get that degree son and we'll set everything up for you to run for whatever position. And that's not the case in marginalized or in minority communities. So A, you need to know that you belong there. You have a story, you have to invest in that story. Another piece is the financial piece. You know you asked me if I'm running for office. You know I don't have a treasure trove of money. I don't have a chest a drawer of money that I can pull from. But kind of from a psychological standpoint and this is innate. This is kind of institutionalized, systemic is asking for money, you know, fundraising, which is a very big part and a lot of the communities that you talked about, there's kind of a stigma with even asking for money. And we're not taught to, marginalized communities, aren't often taught to brag about themselves and you know, running for office is like one long job interview where you have to continue to talk about yourself more and more and more. And so those are just kind of the, the top line obstacles that come in even before you even get in the race.
Joe Fuld (20:24):
Yeah. What I'll say is, from, from my perspective, it's that, you know, fundraising is critically important. I mean we have a future episode coming up with Amy Kershner that is on raising money and I, I think that that is something that you really need to do specialized training on and it's important to get used to it. I have a method that I learned in when I first started running campaigns, which is called the RAT method, which is reason, amount, and time that every time you make an ask, you give people the reason you ask for an amount and when you need that check by. But I think you're right, it, fundraising doesn't come innate to everyone and it's something that is practiced. I think that so often people think that we are born with these skills, whether it's charisma, whether it's the ability to fundraise, whether it's the ability to show empathy. And to me a lot of these really are learned and you can learn them through training and it is actually really important that we find people who have the ability to share that story and not necessarily are like born to run for office. Talk a little a bit about what you all have coming up for next year a National Democratic Training Committee. Like what are the trainings that you have? How do people reach out to you? What are the ways that folks can get access to your training work?
Anthony Robinson (21:44):
Well, you're rubbing the sweet spot now. I never, I will never stop talking about the work that I'm doing because I believe in it so much. But first thing, I would suggest that people go visit, traindemocrats.org get a, a feel for what we have to offer where one of the premier democratic organizations out here that I'm happy to say by the time that this podcast run, we will have again been trained in all 50 States and everyone would have received our trainings for free. So we hit some very good numbers. This year looking at 2S20 and beyond. We're looking to build out our Staff Academy. This past year we have 50 graduates. We're looking to have a hundred. I'm in the field of fundraising, messaging, communications, and we're going to build in, in the future field operations. We're looking to hit all 50 States once again and again building out, we just brought on over 70 new trainers, highly educated experts, people that have been on the ground, they know what's happening on the ground, they know how to make it real for whoever sits in front of our trainings and we're just looking to build out more people. We had over 45,000 people either register online or, or be trained in person with us. And so we want to up that number and anyone that identifies as a Democrat, we want to give you the free tools. We always say, look, take our materials, we have templates, remove our name off of them, put your name on them and and go with it. So our on demand training, we're looking that's, we're going to build that out. And right now it's more candidate focused but we want to have more online training for people looking to work on campaigns as well.
Joe Fuld (23:21):
Well that's amazing. Listen, it's great having you as a guest.
Anthony Robinson (23:25):
Thanks Joe. Thanks for giving us this platform. And again, if you don't want to say national democratic training committee, just say NDTC and remember to visit trainemocrats.org.
Joe Fuld (23:32):
Hey, thanks so much for your time. We really appreciate it.
Anthony Robinson (23:36):
Thank you.
(Music)
Joe Fuld (23:42):
And now we're back. That was a great interview with Anthony Robinson from the National Democratic Training Committee on deciding to run and building a winning campaign. So I always think when I'm training folks, what are the core questions that people should be asking and answering? Running for office is hard. You really want to think about do you have the time, money, support and motivation to win? You want to be realistic with a self assessment. Can you run a viable campaign back at thecampaignworkshop.com we have personal assessment tools. Search the blog. You can definitely read a lot about it, but we think it's super important. You want to think about who do you know? How can folks help? How much can they donate? You want to write this down. You want to think about that one third rule that we talk about. If you can write down and think about the amount of people that can give to create one third of the campaign budget that you need, that's a good place to start to build a campaign.
Martín Diego Garcia (24:45):
Yeah. We have a really great resource on an ebook on the website as well about deciding to run that has a lot of these tools and questions, both of the personal, the financial and the political assessment of how you should be making that decision.
Joe Fuld (24:57):
You really want to think about, and it's in the ebook too, about being strategic about the office you're running for. You don't just want to run for Congress right off the bat. There might be some of you listening to this podcast that have that connection to your community to do that. That's great if you do, but the average candidate starts smaller and you really want to think about, do I have the resources to achieve this office that I want to go for? Whether that's people time or money. Really think about that. Think about the one third rules I've talked about, but it may be that running for city council or school board is a better call than running for Congress. You also want to know your motivation to run. Be clear about why you are going to run. You know that you don't have all the answers, but you want to be on that quest to help people find the answers. Can you make a good pitch to voters? You want to practice the pitch, you want to know what your strengths and weaknesses are. We talk about this with a message box and you really want to understand what your motivation is. Revenge is not a good motivation to run for office.
Martín Diego Garcia (26:07):
Yeah, and I think when you think about your story, right? You really want to center it in your core values, right? Like what do you believe in fairness, justice, a right for folks to live the lives that they want to live and how do you create your story, understand what your personal story is, but also understand how that story connects to your community, right? Are you an educator? Do you work in the health industry? Have you had a sick loved one, right? Like, what are the things that have prompted you to want to run for office and how do you take your story to sort of connect it to the collective we and sort of the challenge that your community is also facing. So they see themselves reflected in your story of why you want to run for office.
Joe Fuld (26:45):
Absolutely. I mean we really believe that a campaign is two sides to a coin. It's not just a negative about your opponent, what your opponent hasn't done. It's about your vision for what that community can be. And that should be reflected as a part of your story and your community's growth as well as your growth. But we also have to remember that it is about the voter and not about you and people need to see themselves through your story. The other piece that we talk about that I think is so important is to get buy in from loved ones. You are going on this journey with a group of people. You need to make sure that your friends, your family, that all of those folks are bought into you run for office because they're going to be going through it too.
Martín Diego Garcia (27:29):
Totally. And it may be your name on the ballot, right? But you have a community of folks with you who are going to be affected by your choice to run for office and remember, right? Like running for office is a huge time commitment and I don't think a lot of people realize that until they're in the thick of the campaign how much time it's actually going to take. And so we highly encourage any of the folks who come to us and highly encourage you to think about actually going to a training for candidates, they can really help prepare you to help you decide if you are actually ready to run. There are a lot of skills involved with running for office that you may only use to run your campaign, right? How to write a good email, how to make a good fundraising pitch. There are a lot of these skills that are very specific to running a campaign that you may have not have learned in school, in college in any other way. So going to those trainings to get those skills is going to be really, really helpful and puts you ahead of the curve of the those other candidates running as well.
Joe Fuld (28:24):
And on the flip side, right, it also might, a training might say, Oh, here's some skills I do have as a social worker, as a graphic designer, as like someone who worked in the advertising industry, whatever it is on how I can use those skills in an engaging way. So it's both of those things.
Martín Diego Garcia (28:44):
Yeah, and again, right, you don't have to have all the answers, but if you're considering running for office, a training is a super helpful way for you to get some questions that you need to answer before deciding to run. The other thing that I really love about training is it really helps democratize some knowledge, right? It really helps sort of breaks down some of the barriers when it comes to race, gender, socioeconomic status in terms of setting up folks for success and really considering what does it mean for you as a, as a person to run and put yourself in that public sphere of running for candidate and also sort of helps you think about how do you build a diverse campaign team. Let's face it, right? Like running for office, it takes money, but that doesn't mean you actually have to be rich to run for office. What you do need to really learn is figuring out what is that compelling story and that case for yourself and your vision for your community that will get folks to invest in your campaign.
Joe Fuld (29:33):
One of the things that we found is that going through a training, we'll put you around a group of people that are going through the same thing. We have had folks go through trainings where they've found volunteers at the training. They found people that they can pick up the phone and run ideas off of. So it helps build that community.
Martín Diego Garcia (29:52):
Yeah. And so in addition to the resources that were mentioned by Anthony that the National Democratic Training Committee at traindemocrats.org offer, we also have a list on thecampaignworkshop.com around progressive training resources that are out there for you to take a look to find one that suits you the best. We work with a couple of them and are honored to do that, but I would highly recommend you thinking about how do you let the people around you become a resource for you and to help you succeed.
Joe Fuld (30:16):
Yeah, and one other thing, you may go to a training and decide you don't want to run for office after all. And that's fine. Running for office is not for everyone and there's plenty of other ways to get involved. Work on a campaign behind the scenes, volunteer, knock on doors, go to a phone bank, become a volunteer trainer to help empower others to run. You want to figure out what you can do to make the greatest impact.
Martín Diego Garcia (30:40):
So hopefully this episode really helps you to think about what to consider when deciding to run for office. On our next episode, we're actually going to be chatting with former mayor of Houston, Annise Parker, who actually ran for office 11 times, if you can believe that. We'll talk with her and walk through what it was like for her to be a candidate, what it is like for her as the CEO, president of the LGBTQ victory fund, and supporting LGBT candidates across the country. Get some lessons learned from her, some challenges that you actually may encounter on your own campaign trail. So tune back in for our next episode with Mayor Annise Parker. But until next time, this is Martín Diego Garcia
Joe Fuld (31:16):
And Joe Fuld breaking down how to win a campaign. See you next time.
Joe Fuld (31:22):
How To Win a Campaign is Joe Fuld, Martín Diego Garcia, Hope Rohrbach, Daniel Lam, Heidi Job, and Elena Veatch. Music by Mike Pinto. Sound editing by Junto Media. Special thanks to the team at The Campaign Workshop. Please review, like, and subscribe wherever you get your podcasts.
(Outro Music)